The thing was, he ran the unit 25 x 2 and was able to charge one unit of my knights on turn 2, beat them in combat, and then pursue into rest of my units since he has such a wide facing. He will win the subsequent combat and then reform into horde formation so that he can get ranks. By running them like this I can only hit a maximum of 8 with a direct hit from a Treb and since he has Void Stone he can stop me from casting dweller's in the only magic phase I have before he charges. I guess I need to use diverters or a suicide Paladin. I think a Lord with Stubborn and a 1+ re-rollable would be decent, but if he reformed into horde he can put out 9 attacks against my lord per turn, which averages 1.2 wounds even with my 1+ re-rollable/5+ ward. I'm thinking of running a Questing Lord with Sirienne's Locket to hold up the horde for a few turns and put out a good number of wounds to at least weaken the unit. With 4 S6 attacks over 3 turns he averages 6.67 wounds which

I think a suicide Paladin would actually work really well for killing his mages though, what about something like this?

Paladin - Gauntlet of the Duel, Pegasus, Questing Vow, Insignia of the Quest, Great Sword, Dragon Helm, Shield (174)

He has a 2+ armor save and a 3+ ward save on his last wound. In combat his armor save is reduced to a 3+, but it doesn't matter as long as I'm in challenges with a champion or mage. I don't think they'll be able to get past a 3+/3+. Since I'm attacking last anyway I gave him a great sword so that I can keep +2 strength even if he accepts the challenge with his champion first. Also, he has 3 wounds because of the Pegasus.

This seems like the perfect solution for a lance honestly. With a facing 75mm wide you will only be in contact with 5 white lions, meaning 10 attacks from them and a possible chanmpion. If you are crafty with the way that you set your characters up you can issue a challenge and pull one model out of your front rank (make sure its a defensive lord to survive the attacks from a Noble) this leaves you with 50mm of facing and if you lined your charge up and maximized based off a lord sat at the corner like such

E E E E E
_K K L (E being Elf, K being knights and L being lord)
_K K K
_K K K

you can reduce your facing to only have 6 total attacks on you where you still get your full lance back at him since our Lance rule says everyone down the flanks is considered in base contact, which over rides the rule for supporting attacks needing to be behind models that could attack (ie. the lord in a challenge)

Charge + 3 ranks + banner means he NEEDS to do 5 wounds before you even attack and do damage. Which, with only 6 attacks and our ward saves and such is a bit of a feat. That also is assuming you don't do any wounds with your attacks, which is very unlikely. He won't be stubborn and you will run down a huge chunk of white lions.

hope that helps.

Sadly he will still be Stubborn as White Lions come with Stubborn as an ability. My Knights would get chewed down in his turn of and I would lose the strength of my lances. I am thinking that the only way I can handle them is with a giant block of M@A. Like 100. With the Prayer Icon of Quenelles and Wyssan's. So in our next game I think that is what I intend to do and we shall see how it goes.

Against White Lions M@A's with the Prayer Icon are a good choice, I've used it to success myself; granted after the lions the unit was destroyed when the SwordMasters followed up on the Lion unit that was lost.

I haven't seen much mentioned here about facing the Everqueen. I had a rough encounter the other day where I had pretty much eliminated everything on the board except for a unit of 20 Swordmasters with a BSB and the Everqueen inside. After luckily knocking the unit down in size due to the HE player failing more 3+ ward saves to my trebuchets than will likely be repeated, I decided to charge with my lord unit accompanied by Knights Errant while my BSB charged his flank.

It was a massacre. Due to piss-poor rolls, I lost 6 of my 9 knights before striking back (with the blessing!) and had my Lord decimated by his Ogreblade-wielding BSB. Although I hit with most of my surviving models, I failed to get a single wound past his 3+ ward save.

In the future I will likely dance around this unit, but come on! 2+ ward save against all magic attacks and (usually) a 3+ ward save against all non-magical attacks -- for every model in one of the HE's most hard-hitting units (2xA, S5, ASF, I6...)?

In hindsight, NOT charging this unit would have won me the game. However, this was only my second game in 8th Edition, and I wasn't aware that a unit could be as screwed up as this one was.

I was considering Feedback Scroll + Mirror to scare her, then suiciding a Paladin on Pegasus to finish her off -- any thoughts, suggestions?

@Verminard - The lions would also get 9 attacks back as HE fight in 3 ranks.

Christophe de Bastonne wrote:
...I was considering Feedback Scroll + Mirror to scare her, then suiciding a Paladin on Pegasus to finish her off -- any thoughts, suggestions?

Unfortunately Mirror & F.Scroll would equal magical attacks, meaning she gets a 2+ ward from the banner of world Dragon against them...

And if the High Elf player had any sense they would run the unit so that she could hide in the second rank, & not on the side of the unit.
Miscast results are magical attacks too.

Dwellers should sort her out.

Logic says they'd be magical attacks, but it just doesn't feel right. Ugh.

I think my best bet will be instead to ignore her and concentrate on wiping the rest of the board. In that particular game, I had some M-a-A toward her flank and some knights in the front. The HE player was worried about giving me his flank, so turtled, which allowed my other knights, the trebs and peg knights to clear the rest of the board. Talk about the arrogance of nobility -- I charged in intending to wipe him off the board completely, and ended up losing the game.

I REALLY don't like the thought of relying on one spell, such as dwellers, to be rid of her. If it's there, sweet, but too many opportunities to miss it.

Christophe de Bastonne wrote:
Logic says they'd be magical attacks, but it just doesn't feel right. Ugh.

I think my best bet will be instead to ignore her and concentrate on wiping the rest of the board. In that particular game, I had some M-a-A toward her flank and some knights in the front. The HE player was worried about giving me his flank, so turtled, which allowed my other knights, the trebs and peg knights to clear the rest of the board. Talk about the arrogance of nobility -- I charged in intending to wipe him off the board completely, and ended up losing the game.

I REALLY don't like the thought of relying on one spell, such as dwellers, to be rid of her. If it's there, sweet, but too many opportunities to miss it.

Ran into a similar list today. It was the Everqueen, 307 white lions, a lvl 2, and the bsb noble. Noble had a great weapon, and a magical banner that gave +2 to casting (or something along those lines). And of course Banner of the World Dragon.

The everqueen was getting +8 to her casts, and with lore of light, meant the got time warp off, and the unit marched 20 up into my grill.

1 round of trebs did remove 5 white lions. I even got a rear charge on them with 50 men at arms, with blessing and wysan's,; however, stubborn won them the day.

In hind sight perhaps throwing the men at arms into the unit, attempting to kill out the characters is the way to go? Score some points from the unit and try to avoid it?

With this in mind any particular units anyone can think well suited to this role? Men at Arms need 5s to hit, which is rough. Pretty much nothing short of a lord will get Initiative high enough to strike before the white lions.

Perhaps 3 units of Mounted Yeomen, double flee continually from the unit, slow it down and try to treb it to death?